March 05, 2007

Some Quick Thoughts About God and Religion





My thoughts on religion, more than most want to know.


Let me start by saying that I was raised Jewish. No, I don't look Jewish because I was adopted at birth. I was brought up around Christian neighbors who were mostly Baptist, but there were some Methodist, and Catholics. My mother was Lutheran before she converted to Judaism. I attended a Christian day school for three years and a Jewish day school for four years and a Catholic military high school for four years. My high school was highly tolerant of other religions so we were taught about Mormonism and Islam, as a study.


My point is I have been exposed to a lot of religions and have had the opportunity to study them and observe people practicing them. All which qualifies me for nothing.


I believe in a God. One God who created everything. I find it hard to believe that the right organisms just happened to be on a planet with water, the right gases, and the exact distance needed from a sun that happens to be the exact temperature needed to sustain life. I'm sure someone good at math could explain that the odds are good that this could happen by chance considering the billions of planets and billions of years this has all been around but I'm not buying it. It all had to start somehow and until we know my theory is as good as any other.


I believe that God exist at a level that we will never understand. That our knowledge of the universe and everything in it barely scratches the surface of his creation.


I believe that all the major religions worship the same God. That God probably enjoys being worshiped in more than one way. Why can't we believe he likes variety? We do. In other words most religions could be right.


I believe that people won't be punished because they are not born into the "right" religion. What chance does a child born in North Korea have to find Christ? Would God really send him to hell because of where he was born? I hope not, that would make no sense.


I believe in evolution and creation. If we can plant a seed knowing it will become an apple tree certainly God could create an atom knowing what it become in a billion years. I do not know if God is involved in our everyday life or if he just set it all in motion knowing the outcome.


I believe God has given us free will and a moral code to guide us. That leading a moral life is all that is required of us.


I believe that people read to much into man made ideas and interpretations. These people hijack religion and direct it in a way that could only serve themselves or they become so fanatical that they lose the original concept of their beliefs.




Things I find odd about religion;


That God stopped talking to people about 2,000 years ago


That God had man write the old testament then had man write a new book that almost contradicts everything in the first book.


That great buildings are built to honor God while most religions preach he cares nothing about wealth.


That most people feel they were lucky enough to be born into the right religion. Honestly believing they are one of the chosen for no other reason than being born.


I could go on and on but I think you get the idea of what I believe. Now if someone could please explain it to me.



28 comments:

Daughter of Night said...

God never stopped talking. People stopped listening.

Freak said...

Amen! Could not agree with your thoughts more.

David said...

Daughter I agree, I just find it odd that for 3000 years God talked to a whole list of People from Abraham to the Apostles. Showed defined miracles then nothing for almost 2000 years. Yes, I believe miracles happen everyday but not these clear cut burning bush miracles you read of in the bible. I just wonder why those people didn't have to have the faith they were shown it. A little bit easier for them if you ask me. And why not a newer testament? If God took the time to have the laws of the land written down then updated surely clarification for modern times is well over due?

David said...

Lindsay: Thanks, I believe we have very similar beliefs. I'm glade to hear I'm not the only one who believes in God but knows we don't have the capacity to fully understand him.

Daughter of Night said...

Well, okay...

The Bible... both Testaments... has been translated, edited, re-translated, re-edited, censored, and creatively interpreted. Anything you read in that tome should be taken with a grain of salt and thought of symbolically.

The same miracles happen now as happened then. Think of it this way: In a country of 280 million people, a one-in-a-million event happens 280 times a day.

And if you believe that One God created us, why would you believe that God created us without an ability to understand our own Creation?????? Is your God so egotistical that it's necessary to remain a big mystery?? I doubt it. :-)

All IMHO, of course. Except the Bible and the miracle stuff. :-)

A

David said...

As far as the any book written by man I do take them with a grain of salt. My point was that other people live every detail of their life by them, which is something I can't understand.

As I said I believe in miracles too but when is the last time you heard of a parting of a sea (please don't say tsunami) or a few fish feeding thousands? I believe these are symbolic lessons. If they really occurred why don't they in modern times? Of course you could count the image of the Virgin Marry they found on that grill cheese sandwich but I don't :)

I don't think God cares if we understand him or not. Why do we have to understand our creation even if we had the intelligences. A dog, created by God, doesn't understand his creation and never will. Why would it be so hard to believe that we couldn't either. Are we so egotistical to believe that nothing could be beyond our understanding? An ear of corn doesn't know why or how it grows does that mean it will be any less nutritious or filling? Does a telephone have to understand me before it can serve me? I don't think God is trying to be a big mystery, his abilities are just beyond our understanding. My understanding at least.

:)

Daughter of Night said...

Symbolic lessons, indeed.

The difference:

Ear of corn = non-sentient

Human = sentient

:-)

Thank you for going out on a limb and posting your beliefs. That's a very courageous thing to do!! I feel honored to have shared them.

A

David said...

and the dog...

I knew when I used corn that was going to happen. My second choice was a cow but I liked the imagery of the corn growing in the field, reaching for the sun, swaying in the wind with green leaves hanging down... I think I'll call the wife and see if we can have some corn tonight hmmm


Admittedly I had to look up the word sentient, you and your big words. They don't scare me! . . (much) :p

Daughter of Night said...

I am not qualified to hypothesize - much less state! - what dogs are and are not aware of.

That's the point - God ISN'T trying to be a "big mystery." That's why I am consistently disturbed when folks present Deity as such. What I am asking you is WHY you've deemed these simple truths to be beyond your grasp? Because they most certainly are not.

{{{{RT}}}}}

I am respectfully bowing out of further discussion.

:-)

<3

A

David said...

LOL you're cute and you crack me up. I thought you tried to bow out of this two comments ago. Of course I knew what you were saying four commnets ago, after that I was just having fun :)

Daughter of Night said...

Damn! I've been sucked in again!!!!!!!

LOL

A

Daughter of Night said...

(I am also choosing NOT to regcognize that you STILL haven't answered my question...)

LOL

David said...

Oh I didn't answer it because when someone bows out "respectfully" I try to shut up, but then I didn't did I...

Worse than that I went on and on about corn for no reason didn't I...

And I still didn't answer the question did I...

Seriously, I was going to answer it in this comment but I had already clicked the mouse :(

harbinger said...

I just can't leave the comments at 13.

Daughter of Night said...

ROFLMAO.

Meanie.

David said...

Great Harbinger, now you've injected superstition into a discussion about religion OMG! LOL

Ok if we must,

My thoughts on superstitions in religion... nah , I've done enough damage here already.:)

Daughter: Again, I had to look up ROFLMAO, thanks :) and no corn tonight, damn!

Ok, ok the question

What I am asking you is WHY you've deemed these simple truths to be beyond your grasp? Because they most certainly are not.

Wouldn't you agree that for God to be well, God, he would have to be operating on a level we have yet to grasp? We can explain very little about our own world, let alone the rest of the universe. Yes, I can understand the concept of God but not his abilities or his genius. Much in the same way I understand Albert Einstein. Yes I know he existed and he contributed to science and even what he contributed to science but I will never understand how he could arrive at his theories when so many before him couldn't. Not a mystery just beyond my grasp. Does that answer it?

Now, are you in or are you out? LOL

Daughter of Night said...

No. You still haven't answered my question.

I did not ask you if you believe God is beyond your understanding. You have demnstrated that you do, in fact, believe that.

I asked you WHY you believe that.

It's a different question, yes?

:-)

So, I guess I'm in. Because the anwswer to YOUR question...

"Wouldn't you agree that for God to be well, God, he would have to be operating on a level we have yet to grasp?"

...is a resounding no.

:-)

And that's not because I think your beliefs are invalid. I would never say that to anyone... you believe what you believe and that's a beautiful and personal thing.

:-)

Anonymous said...

Laplace's vision, of scientific determinism, involved knowing the positions and speeds of the particles in the universe, at one instant of time. So it was seriously undermined by Heisenberg's Uncertainty principle. How could one predict the future, when one could not measure accurately both the positions, and the speeds, of particles at the present time? No matter how powerful a computer you have, if you put lousy data in, you will get lousy predictions out.

Einstein was very unhappy about this apparent randomness in nature. His views were summed up in his famous phrase, 'God does not play dice'. He seemed to have felt that the uncertainty was only provisional: but that there was an underlying reality, in which particles would have well defined positions and speeds, and would evolve according to deterministic laws, in the spirit of Laplace. This reality might be known to God, but the quantum nature of light would prevent us seeing it, except through a glass darkly.

Einstein's view was what would now be called, a hidden variable theory. Hidden variable theories might seem to be the most obvious way to incorporate the Uncertainty Principle into physics. They form the basis of the mental picture of the universe, held by many scientists, and almost all philosophers of science. But these hidden variable theories are wrong. The British physicist, John Bell, who died recently, devised an experimental test that would distinguish hidden variable theories. When the experiment was carried out carefully, the results were inconsistent with hidden variables. Thus it seems that even God is bound by the Uncertainty Principle, and can not know both the position, and the speed, of a particle. So God does play dice with the universe. All the evidence points to him being an inveterate gambler, who throws the dice on every possible occasion.

harbinger said...

That's what I said too.

harbinger said...

If God had a name what would it be?

And would you call it to his face?
If you were faced with him in all his glory
what would you ask if you had just one question?

Yeah, Yeah, God is great
Yeah, Yeah, God is good
Yeah Yeah yeah yeah yeah

What if God was one of us?
Just a slob like one of us
Just a stranger on the bus
Trying to make his way home

If God had a face
What would it look like?
And would you want to see
If seeing meant that you would have to believe
In things like heaven and in Jesus and the saints
and all the Prophets

Yeah Yeah God is great
Yeah Yeah God is good
Yeah Yeah yeah yeah yeah

What if God was one of us?
Just a slob like one of us
Just a stranger on the bus
Trying to make his way home
Just trying to make his way home
Back up to Heaven all alone
Nobody callin' on the phone
cept for the Pope maybe in Rome

Yeah Yeah God is great
Yeah Yeah God is good
Yeah Yeah yeah yeah

What if God was one of us?
Just a slob like one of us
Just a stranger on the bus
Trying to make his way home
just trying to make his way home
like a holy rolling stone
Back up to Heaven all alone
just trying to make his way home
Nobody callin' on the phone
'cept for the Pope maybe in Rome

Time Traveller said...

If there really was a god, why would he/she create slugs?

David said...

Daughter: I get the method to your madness now. You ask a question and I answer said question. An interesting way of doing things. I 'll have to try that
:)... someday :P

I think 20 Something just gave me the answer to your question. Thanks 20 Something. Why do I believe that God is beyond my thinking... because I don't know why he made slugs... why babies die, why there is evil in the world, why bad things happen to good people, why am I here or how, how he created an atom? a planet? a thought? Billions of people haven't been able to answer these questions but I believe God knows and not only does he know but he created it all. He has to be truly awesome.

The simple answer, faith... Faith that the God I pray to and worship has more control over my world and events than I do. That's it *shrug*

Daughter of Night said...

Thank you. :-)

I wonder if you are satisfied with that answer, now that it's out there in black and white?

And how would you feel if you knew - not believed, but knew - that the opposite was, in fact, the truth? That you have more control over events in your life than any other entity - and that you were created just that way?

(You don't have to answer that one). :-)

You know, this discussion would be a lot more fun over Guinness.

{{{RT}}}

A

harbinger said...

I think that man created superstition, religion, and a God figure because life was so hard and disappointing that he needed something to pray to.
So the crops would grow, so the summer would come, so the sun would rise.
For us to think we are so special, that an entity had to have created us, just sounds like the same old conceited, self obsessed, egotistical beings that we are.

I think Idol worshipping was and is the most destructive and detremental aspect of the human reign and existance on this planet.

Thank a God, blame a God, ask a God, do what your God tells you, saves a little time having to think for yourself, and trying to choose the right path to take, and take responsibility for our own actions.

I believe in the power of life, and that power is all around us, if you can grasp it, you can harnness it and use it.
I have witnessed the strength, and I have seen the beauty of life and I have matured enough to learn that respecting and caring for ALL life is truly the answer and the focus of the main path we need be on.

David said...

HB: Maybe God's dice have 5,832,054,000 sides and he knows which side will hit :) because I really do think this game is fixed.

Daughter: I'm a simple person that lives by logic and proof, so if It is logical and or provable I am open to it. I had a lot of fun even without the Guinness.Of course if we had sat drinking for the 24 hours it took us to discuss this we wouldn't have cared about any of it anyway ;)

{{{Daughter}}}

HB: I do believe a lot of the traditions, ceremonies, and rituals are man made. People do tend to blame there short comings on God and thank God for things I doubt he would even care about. I can certainly respect your feelings and belief about life and I certainly can't blame you for feeling people should take responsibility for their own life, I agree 100%. I still have to wonder how it all started and believe that someone at some point had to create something, even if it was just one particle, that set everything into motion.

and just so you know there were 13 comments on my post below this one :)

harbinger said...

I'm slow, you know that, not slug slow, just at ease. I was getting to the post below.
Someone creating all this? There you go, why someone? We don't even know if this is really here.
By the sheer vastness of space the numbers are constant with the theory that there are many more life forms that exist in the universe.
Many more planets that are ideal for life growth.
Then that can all be explained by,'God made them too.'
Much too simple an answer for me, though one will always wonder where did it all begin.
Iam sure that this is not our first home, and that our seed is strewn around other places in the universe.
God is just the easiest way of explaining it all, for our never ending quest of knowledge.

harbinger said...

Could not leave it at 26, two 13's.

David said...

LOL harbinger, I hope 28 is good? :)